Cobb Budget: No Tax Increase, No Library Closings
The county commissioners are holding a regular meeting at 9 a.m., with the big fiscal decisions scheduled for the middle of the session.
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We're live from the Cobb County Board of Commissioners meeting, where the five-member board is due to pass an amended budget to close a gap estimated at more than $31 million for the rest of fiscal 2011, which runs through Sept. 30. We'll be tweeting live at the various Cobb Patch Twitter feeds, including @EastCobbPatch, then copying the feeds into this file for further reading, thinking and commenting. The agenda for the meeting is attached.
Just to clarify a few budget things, the Windy Hill Senior Center and the adult day care center will close, but Commissioner Bob Ott said the Windy Hill center's closing has been in the works because it's the least used of the centers. None of the libraries will close, although they will have to accommodate $422,000 in cuts that will likely result in further reductions in opening hours.
The Parks and Recreation Department must cut $968,000 but won't have to close any facilities. The Mable House, however, becomes a rental-only facility, and various programs and services will be cut back.
A key element of the plan, in addition to the use of some $4.5 million in reserve funds, is the pending enactment of Georgia House Bill 280, which will allow the county to move around $2.5 million in 911 funds, $2 million to the general fund and $500,000 to the fire fund.
Ott says the decision to reject Powell "blindsided" him. He says he has no idea why the three commissioners voted against her because they never told him they had any objections. The vote came without discussion over the proposed appointment.
11:51 a.m. And the meeting is over. Thank you for following the meeting with Patch.
11:50 a.m. Ott says that the board usually goes with the recommendation of the commissioner. He's obviously not happy.
11:47 a.m. The board rejects Bob Ott's nomination of former Commissioner Thea Powell to the Citizens Oversight Committee, 3-2, with Goreham, Birrell and Lee opposed. The board unanimously approves Ott's pick of Bob Barr for the committee.
11:44 a.m. Birrell says everybody should vote for the animal shelter online so it can get a $100,000 award. She also mentions the next Mabry Park advisory meeting April 22.
11:43 a.m. Both Commissioners Thompson and Birrell just had new appointees to the Citizens Oversight Committee approved.
11:40 a.m. She is telling the commissioners several different ways they could save money.
11:37 a.m. New speaker Bobbie Jo Ryan, our last of the session, says she doesn't understand why there was such short notice on the plan to close 13 libraries. She says the threat to the libraries "lit a fire under my butt" to get involved and pay attention to the county government.
11:35 a.m. New speaker, regular Craig Harfoot, says the county shouldn't fund nonprofits, but he says he understands they keep the commissioners in office by saying nice things about them and telling people to vote for them.
11:32 a.m. A new speaker, James Travers, represents the fire department. First responders will be late getting to people who are bleeding, he says.
11:30 a.m. He says there is a lot of spending that is uneccesary. Money doesn't grow on trees, not even in Cobb County, he says. (We'll have video of part of Oak's speech later.)
11:28 a.m. Next speaker is a little boy, 10-year-old Oak Martin. He's home-schooled and uses Mountain View Library.
11:26 a.m. "I've got my checkbook right here," he says in offering to pay a millage increase to preserve fire services at the current level.
11:24 a.m. He would rather see the board raise taxes.
11:22 a.m. New speaker Chuck Cahn says he is concerned with cuts to the Fire Department. He says the potential increase in homeowner's insurance rates would be greater than the millage increase required to avoid cutting fire services.
11:19 a.m. "If you combine all the senior centers, you not only will not lose money, you will gain money," she says.
11:17 a.m. A 70-year-old speaker named Leslie Matheny (she cited her age in noting that although she is speaking on senior issues, she is not herself a senior) is calling for opening the new building on Powder Springs Road that was meant to be a senior center but never opened. She says it would work as a central location if the county is closing Windy Hill and other senior centers across the county.
11:15 a.m. The board upholds the denial of the license 4-0, with Birrell having recused herself.
11:13 a.m. Hernandez acknowledges he has made a lot of mistakes but he's trying to support his family.
11:10 a.m. The board is holding a hearing over the denial of an alcohol service license to Jeffrey Hernandez, who works as a waiter at Bay Breeze in Marietta. He turned out to have a couple of felony drug convictions that he did not disclose in his application for the county license, according to the testimony.
11:07 a.m. The board votes to sell 1.75 acres of property because it is unserviceable for government. It should be worth $3.5 million.
11:05 a.m. All of the transportation items on the agenda passed unanimously. Now we're on to the support services section of the agenda.
11:01 a.m. On Item 7, a change order passes to cover a 65-cent change. "Is there any question we're watching every cent?" Lee asks?
10:59 a.m. We're flying through transportation items. The board approves sidewalk improvements on the East Cobb Trail Extension, among other items.
10:57 a.m. The consent agenda just passed 5-0 as we returned to more mundane parts of the meeting.
10:45 a.m. After that emotional hour, the commissioners take a 10-minute break.
10:44 a.m. Amendments to the budget for the remainder of 2011 pass 4-1, with Goreham voting no. Lee makes the motion with Ott seconding it.
10:43 a.m. Speaking to the crowd, she says if you have to wait when you call, it's because they are taking furlough days. She's the only constitutional officer to speak about the budget.
10:41 a.m. The probate judge says she met with her staff, and they said they would take furlough days, but marriage and gun licenses are going to take more time.
10:40 a.m. Goreham says she hopes she's wrong about that.
10:38 a.m. Commissioner Helen Goreham says she's happy the budget was balanced without a tax increase, but she doesn't believe a 10 percent across-the-board cut is actually achievable.
10:37 a.m. Commissioner JoAnn Birrell says public safety is a priority, but she appreciates the work that went into this plan. She says this is the best plan.
10:36 a.m. Commissioner Woody Thompson says he's uncomfortable with public safety furloughs, but emphasizes that it's only for five months.
10:35 a.m. Ott says spending will have to be watched carefully and things should be delayed until next fiscal year if possible.
10:33 a.m. Ott says the "wolf is away from the door" for now.
10:33 a.m. Ott thanks the filled room of people for coming out today.
10:32 a.m. Ott says that if they do have to furlough police, then make sure safety isn't compromised
10:32 a.m. Commissioner Bob Ott says his priority has always been to avoid police furloughs, but he says that's not possible right now.
10:31 a.m. Some people in the crowd are leaving now that they've heard the plan.
10:30 a.m. On June 28 the Citizens Oversight Committee will give its report to the commissioners.
10:29 a.m. Lee says the state and federal governments have made cuts that have trickled down to the county. He also says the school system will have to absorb child training costs that the county has covered.
10:28 a.m. Lee says there will be additional cuts in 2012.
10:25 a.m. Lee says the county has never had to take money from reserves before.
10:24 a.m. Lee plans to meet once a week with Pehrson and County Manager David Hankerson to track the financial plan.
10:23 a.m. The furlough days include the police. We will not let a 911 call go unanswered, Lee says.
10:22 a.m. Lee says when the county built the regional libraries, the intent was to close the smaller libraries eventually.
10:20 a.m. Lee says libraries will probably have reduced hours to accommodate the $422,000 cut.
10:20 a.m. Lee says the parks department will take a bigger hit than the 10 percent.
10:19 a.m. Lee emphasizes there is no millage increase.
10:19 a.m. Pehrson is done with his presentation.
10:17 a.m. The budget uses $2.7 million of general fund reserves and $1.8 million of fire fund reserves, cutting the general fund balance just below the minimum according to county policy.
10:15 a.m. One-time moves (mostly cuts) will save more than $16 million between the general fund and the fire fund. The debt service fund is a legal liability and can't be cut.
10:14 a.m. Libraries and senior centers will stay open but will have to make cuts.
10:13 a.m. Five furlough days across the board. The Mable House becomes a rental only facility.
10:12 a.m. There are $3.7 million in departmental cuts in the general fund, including more than $400,000 from libraries; an additional $732,000 would be cut from the fire fund. The toal is $4.4 million in cuts.
10:10 a.m. The county won't know the bottom line on the property digest until June.
10:09 a.m. The projected decline in the property digest is 6.85 percent, which isn't as bad as the 9 percent to 10 percent expected, which means the budget deficit overall is only $27.1 million, not $31.6 million.
10:06 a.m. Finance Director Jim Pehrson is going through the background. Now presents the bottom line: cutting one-time expenditures, reduing departmental operating budgets 10 percent and shifting 0.11 mil from the general fund to the debt service fund.
10:04 a.m. "We're at a time that is unique for Cobb County," Lee says in introduing the finance director for the final budget proposal. "We're in a tough situation."
10:02 a.m. Children and adults present budget petitions to an officer for the board.
10 a.m. "It's a resource used every day in every way in every region," she says. She also adds a plug for the senior centers.
9:59 a.m. Libraries have already taken a hit with reduced hours, she says.
9:58 a.m. She says libraries are used by everyone. She mentions all the books for required reading just for her three children. And she's just one parent.
9:55 a.m. The final speaker is Karen Hallacy. (We'll get the spelling cleared up after the meeting.)
9:55 a.m. Doyle says libraries are meeting a demand. Closing libraries is a serious issue, she says to applause. "Please don't close any of the libraries."
9:54 a.m. Doyle: "Remember the people who don't have Internet. They couldn't email you."
9:54 a.m. She says people can't afford the Internet at home and they come to the libraries to use the the computers there.
9:52 a.m. She says home-schooled students and many others come to the libraries all the time. Libraries are vital.
9:50 a.m. The fifth speaker is Demi Doyle, who says she's here on behalf of all libraries.
9:49 a.m. "We can't afford one furlough day," Mestre says. He adds, "It's time to raise the millage rate. It's time. ... There's no more cuts in public safety. Y'all are proud of your public safety, prove it."
9:47 a.m. The fourth speaker, Jorge Mestre, is concerned about public safety and speaks on behalf of police officers.
9:40 a.m. Third speaker is a woman from East Cobb, Carol Harless. She mentions that it's National Library Week. Her concern is the closing of the East Cobb Library, which is new and is the third-busiest in the county, she says.
9:39 a.m. He offers documentation of waste.
9:38 a.m. Next up is John Sullivan, another retired police officer. He's talking about on-call issues and waste within the police department.
9:35 a.m. He does cite one law enforcement area to cut: the safety village.
9:35 a.m. He suggests cuts to other areas. He mentions the golf course as fluff and says CCT is "a Dracula draining blood from the county."
9:32 a.m. He talks about furloughs within in public safety: Public safety hasn't had a pay increase in four years. No complaints. But furloughs are hard to explain to the rank and file.
9:32 a.m. He's a retired deputy police chief and says he doesn't see how the police can cut anymore.
9:30 a.m. First speaker is Billy Mull: He says he's not here to bash anybody. He's not talking about libraries, but public safety.
9:29 a.m.: About 25 people raise their hands in support of the senior centers and a smaller number for the parks.
9:27 a.m. Lee says the board has received more than 5,000 emails against closing the libraries.
9:25 a.m. Lee asks all the people here to support the libraries to raise their hands. The count is 200 to 225, plus about 50 outside.
9:24 a.m. Time for the budget discussion.
9:23 a.m. Instead of a millage increase, the plan moves 0.11 mil from the general fund to the debt service fund and cuts the fire fund by 10 percent.
9:20 a.m. April 19 is Patriots Day. Commissioner Helen Goreham is presenting a proclamation to the the Sons of the American Revolution.
9:18 a.m. New budget proposal, called "the final budget proposal," has no tax increase and cuts the departmental operating budgets 10 percent across the board instead of shutting down specific facilities.
9:15 a.m. Commission Chairman Tim Lee is recognizing community banks by proclaiming this Community Bank Month.
9:11 a.m. Commissioner JoAnn Birrell is presenting a proclamation declaring April 25 to 30 to be Community Development Block Grant Week.
9:09 a.m. Commissioner Woody Thompson is presenting a proclamation declaring April Fair Housing Month.
9:07 a.m. Tim Lee plans to move the budget up in the agenda, right after presentations.
9:05 a.m. The invocation and pledge are out of the way. Standing room only in the meeting. Reached the limit, according to the fire marshal.
9 a.m. Only six members of the public are expected to be allowed to address the board.
8:50 a.m. The boardroom is full, with a large number of people wearing red paper hearts that read "I love my library." The proposed closing of 13 of 17 county libraries to help eliminate the budget deficit has drawn out the people.
Save Cobb Libraries
9:29 am on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
Oh he's crafty. Pitting homeowners/public safety concerns against library supporters.
Pam J
10:09 am on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
It's interesting that the first slide they just put up about the budget showed March 22, 2010. The guy did point out that it should be 2011.
Tina
10:48 am on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
Why are they even considering cutting costs in the public safety area? Our police, fire depts and EMTs, etc. earn little enough for dangerous jobs in the first place! How about cutting government "office" staff pay 5% across the board? Cut judges salaries? Close each and every library in the county an extra couple of hours a day? There are compromises and other options here, but they are not being considered!
Pam J
12:51 pm on Wednesday, April 13, 2011
A starting firefighter's salary is over $38,000. And 18-year-old with a high school diploma or GED can start with the fire department or police department and start out making $38,500.
Kimberly
10:48 am on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
Well that's awesome! Let us forget about public safety for a few days, but no worries, the library that only has 3 people in it will still be open!
I wonder what's gonna happen in 5 months... same issue is gonna return???
Chip Jacobs
10:51 am on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
Hi, Kimberly. Commissioner Goreham hinted at that idea, that this is the Cobb County equivalent of a congressional continuing resolution, and the real budget fight is coming this summer when the 2012 budget has to be created, including restoring the fund balance.
Ann
11:04 am on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
So, the Mable House will be a rental only facility. So much for those great children's programs and adult classes which had become a great part of the Cobb facility.
Pam J
11:34 am on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
Even though I don't want to pay more in property taxes, the millage rate has not changed in years. I would rather see it go up a little and keep all of the public facilities open and keep our county safe. I am so proud of the people who showed up in support of the libraries and senior centers. It may just be a temporary fix, but I don't expect the fight to go out of everybody. We have to keep up with what is going on. No more apathy. And the guy is just now talking about money we give to non-profit organizations. I can't really see how you can justify closing libraries and laying off employees so we can keep a lot of unnecessary organizations afloat.
Cobb Co Firefighter Wife
12:13 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
Gosh I sure hope all these Library frequenters AREN'T IN A WRECK on their way there or back!!!!!
Pam J
12:53 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
I understand why you are upset, but five furlough days spread out won't hurt too much. Just be thankful your husband still has a job. I have been unemployed for over a year now, and I don't want to hear anybody complaining about their job. I truly admire our firefighters and appreciate the jobs they do. I also admire most of the police force. But when you see a policeman sitting in the same spot everyday trying to catch speeders while houses are being robbed a couple of miles away, I do wonder where the focus is. Revenue, I guess. Our citizens will be safe as long as the public workers remember that they are extremely lucky to have jobs and do the best they can to keep those jobs.
George P Burdell
12:56 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
Cobb Co Firefighter Wife, your bile seems a bit misplaced to me. It should be aimed at the Cobb County Commission who allowed themselves to get into theis fix in the first place and then again for them to just kick the can down the road. For the most part your best bet for having citizens that understand the situation and wanting a rational solution to prevail comes from those very same library users.
Chris Roberts
7:44 am on Wednesday, April 13, 2011
Hey, I went to college with a George P Burdell. Wonder if it's you?
Kimberly
1:05 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
"But when you see a policeman sitting in the same spot everyday trying to catch speeders while houses are being robbed a couple of miles away, I do wonder where the focus is."
Don't you think if they knew the house was being robbed that's where they would be??
I agree with Firefighter Wife. These men and women work extremely hard to keep us safe without any raises at all. How do we repay them? By furloughing them for 5 days. A week doesn't sound like much but when you don't make a lot to begin with and you're talking about taking a week away... it turns into a lot more!
I think this issue isn't truly dead yet and when they have to approve the budget for the next fiscal year some of the same things will be on the chopping block.
Pam J
1:33 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
Don't you think that maybe if the policemen and policewomen would spend more time driving through neighborhoods so that maybe they can see something wrong or at least show everybody that the police are out there protecting us would be a good idea. Speeding tickets protect us in a way, but I really don't want to be robbed. Did you see how many houses were robbed in one small area last week? Granted, it was the Powder Springs Police jurisdiction, but on those days when the houses were robbed, the police were parked on the side of Florence Road and on C. H. James Parkway with their radar guns out. And the fact that you state that firefighters haven't gotten raises - welcome to the real world. Most people aren't getting raises. And I respect the fact that these people wanted to be firemen, but it was their choice. I will support them in any way I can, but I will make them God-like. And I, like a lot of other people in this county, am living on $330 a week And I have to pay tax on that. So as long as you are getting a freakin' paycheck and the benefits that go with it, don't complain.
the furloughed
2:18 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
pam, wow..you are clear that it's not the powder springs police department that is now being furloughed, right?
and driving around a neighborhood protects us while stopping traffic violators doesn't?
and just to be clear, houses don't get robbed. people get robbed. houses get burglarized.
raises. that's a whole nother ball of wax. i do believe there are those individuals within Cobb County Govt getting raises. not those in public safety. not for years. and now they are being furloughed. the COBB COUNTY EMPLOYEE needs broad shoulders to continue carrying this county on his/her back so we can continue boasting about such a low millage rate!
Pam J
3:27 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
the furloughed - I just mentioned the Powder Springs police force. The same thing goes on with the Cobb County police. And okay, houses get burglarized, not robbed. Geez. And the company I worked for before I was laid off wasn't giving any raises either. My brother who has worked for the same company for 15 years hasn't gotten a raise in two or three years. Nobody is getting raises in the private sector. We have record unemployment. The people in public safety are important, but there again, we are putting them on a higher pedestal than everybody else. Just like with a private company, public employees have to give a little.
Jeremy DeJames
1:32 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
Cobb county has some of the most qualified public safety personnel in the country (true professionals). If we want this to continue we need to reevaluate our priorities. Training isn't cheep, education isn't cheep, equipment isn't cheep. If we won't second best keep cutting!
Cobb Co Firefighter Wife
2:14 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
Let me make something clear...my statement was not directed toward the 5 day pay cut, the no raise in 4 years or THE BENEFITS that we pay to have. It's about response times being lengthened because of manpower and equipment or lack thereof, and subsequently the difference between LIFE and DEATH.
Pam J
3:17 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
Okay, once again, I doubt very seriously if we will suffer because of this. I expect the fire department and the police force to always have enough people to handle the situation at hand. I worked with the father of the Cobb County Police Chief (John Houser) and he told me that they tended to overhire to cover for long illnesses and such. One or two less police officers or one less firefighter during one week is not going to kill anybody. Besides, most of the firefighters spend more down time than anything. And notice I said "most". That will not apply to everybody. You first comment just irritated me by saying that if anybody driving to and from the library would be in danger if we had a wreck.
Bill
2:39 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
This 'closing the libraries etc' simply does not pass the smell test.
Lee announced a few days ago that all these draconian closings were going to be necessary and got people all stirred up and anxious. Citizens thought their library or Senior Center was going to close, the employees thought they would be out of jobs, and now Chairman Lee pulls a magic rabbit out of his hat and no more closings!
Sorry folks, this is just political grandstanding of the worst sort. I'm sure he had this all scripted so it would appear that he was the Hero of the hour and Savior of the Library. Look for Chairman Lee to be announcing for a higher public office in 2012. My opinion is that he is just another political hack and not deserving of any pats on the back for this slight of hand trickery.
Bill Harris, Kennesaw
http://cobbcountylibrary.blogspot.com/
Pam J
3:19 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
I don't think there is any "grandstanding" at all. I honestly don't think they expected the backlash they got. Plus, he certainly did not make any of the county employees happy. I don't like that we were not aware of the changes until last Thursday, so maybe he did think he could slide it in, but never underestimate the power of the people when it comes to free stuff!
taylor
4:43 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
Thank you to our commisioners for you can care less about ur votes the houses they live in ur families only urselfs hahahaha now wow that's a surprise! Lee hahahaha smug but no reason to be you could not even imagine what our public safety deal with but hey not ur problem! But hey when house catch fire or wrecks happen or heartattacks to a love one or a loveone gets robbed call the Libary I am sure Pam will answer!
Pam J
5:02 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
taylor, if the library would hire me, I would answer! Once again, I've been unemployed for over a year now. Maybe I'm looking at this a little different than those of you who are gainfully employed. I still think everything is being blown out of proportion. And I hate that you men (I assume you are a man) had to learn how to type.
Cobb Co Firefighter Wife
5:13 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
For the record....firefighters work 56 hours a week - straight time. Their "down time" consist of 279 ISO training hours just to keep homeowners insurance down, 120 state required training hours, additional training to keep accreditation to keep business coming into the county, advanced cardiac life support training, CPR and basic EMT training, night drills, fit for duty tests and the list keeps going.
Taxpayers have been misinformed into believing they are going to save a dime. Those measly 5 furlough days will likely raise the ISO rating which will in turn triple everyones homeowners insurance. If you don't believe me, call your insurance company and ask them about how much impact a countys ISO rating has on your premium.
Cobb Co Firefighter Wife
5:16 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
You go Taylor! I don't care if you don't know how to type! :)
Cobb Co Firefighter Wife
5:18 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
Hey Pam, Cobb police and fire are hiring right now if your fit for duty.
Pam J
8:04 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
I'm fit, but I am 57 years old. I look at the Cobb County job web site every day. I see what they are hiring for. And I apply for every one I am qualified for. Being a firefighter or police person are not jobs I am ever going to be considered for.
Ana Martin
12:20 am on Wednesday, April 13, 2011
Cobb County has a hiring freeze right now. The police and fire departments aren't supposed to be hiring.
William Schlundt
7:18 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
I visit the Main Marietta library twice a week. It's not very quiet. Men sleeping in the cubicles. People sitting at the tables where it has a sign that reads ( No Cell Phone's ) and three people are on the cell phone. One person sitting on the floor while a woman is braiding his hair. On and on.
concerned
8:02 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
Completely disagree pam. Comparing cops and firefighters to police and fire is unacceptable. Look at the 2 jobs and there relationship to cuts. If a police officer is on scene without backup for extended periods of time, they not only increase their own personal life danger, but any one else in the area.
For fire, the nfpa and osha both suggest 4 firefighters per engine staffing. Cobb is at 3. If you pull up line of duty deaths from firefighters, a large percentage happen due to the lack of staffing. Ask a librarian to do more with less, and they put more books on a shelf. Firefighters are expected to carry more weight of equipment, provide superior service, and be efficient in all stressful events.
Yes I'm a firefighter, and yes I'm bias, but I go to work with the risk and assumption that I could die. Not take sick leave, not get workers comp, but die.
Libraries are not a necessity, they are a luxury. You can't afford the internet, then you can take cct to the 4 ones that are open. Should I expect free phone service, without paying? Should I expect a car even though I can't make the monthly payments?
Citizens want us to provide the up most professionalism and the highest efficiency in service, but yet you don't honor our sacrifice. We don't do it for the pay, we do it to protect our citizens. Its a shame they won't do the same for us.
Pam J
8:20 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
First of all, thank you for the work you do. I never meant to demean your importance. Now, for you say that libraries are luxuries is just not fair. Would you like to deny kids the right to read books that their parents could never afford to buy? Not to mention I certainly can't afford to buy books right now, so the library has been a wonderful place to go. And I would like to see the statistics on how many line of duty deaths there have been due to "lack of staffing". How many Cobb firemen have died while fighting a fire? I've lived in Cobb County all my life, and I don't recall that many. Once again, I really do appreciate the fact that you wanted to help people. I just think that five unpaid days during the year is just a small sacrifice in order to keep your job. If I had been given that chance instead of losing my job completely, I would have jumped at it. I have had to completely disrupt my life because I can't find a stupid job.
concerned
8:06 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
*i correct my last post*
Completely disagree pam. Comparing cops and firefighters to librarians or parks and rec is unacceptable. Look at the 2 jobs and there relationship to cuts. If a police officer is on scene without backup for extended periods of time, they not only increase their own personal life danger, but any one else in the area.
For fire, the nfpa and osha both suggest 4 firefighters per engine staffing. Cobb is at 3. If you pull up line of duty deaths from firefighters, a large percentage happen due to the lack of staffing. Ask a librarian to do more with less, and they put more books on a shelf. Firefighters are expected to carry more weight of equipment, provide superior service, and be efficient in all stressful events.
Yes I'm a firefighter, and yes I'm bias, but I go to work with the risk and assumption that I could die. Not take sick leave, not get workers comp, but die.
Libraries are not a necessity, they are a luxury. You can't afford the internet, then you can take cct to the 4 ones that are open. Should I expect free phone service, without paying? Should I expect a car even though I can't make the monthly payments?
Citizens want us to provide the up most professionalism and the highest efficiency in service, but yet you don't honor our sacrifice. We don't do it for the pay, we do it to protect our citizens. Its a shame they won't do the same for us.
Bill
8:12 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
I was there Monday passing out post cards and magnets and while I didn't see any hair brading I did see sleeping bums and a lot of staff, I also noticed this library also has far to many copies of the same titles on the shelves. Now that the issue of various libraries closing has been put to bed the management at the library better turn their attention to getting the piles of duplicate titles OUT of the Main and Regional libraries and out to the smaller branch libraries.
This is defnitely a lack of attention to details that has to be taken in hand by the Library Director and the managers of the Main and Regional libraries. It isn't rocket science and now a month plus after I brought the matter to the Directors attention there is still nothing being done to correct the situation.
What these folks with advanced library degrees need is a couple of bins and instructions to staff to walk down the aisles and when they come across 8 to 18 copies of the same title on the shelf, they leave half a dozen and put the rest in the bins to be distributed to the smaller libraries that they serve. This might actually take one person 2-3 hours to collect the overages and it should be done once a week.
See how easy it is to recognize the problem and propose a way to fix it! Now if we can get these overpaid management people to do this we will have some decent books out in the smaller libraries.
taylor
8:18 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
Yo Pam or anybody else who doubts ur Firemen or policeman have a tough job get on the highway an watch a teenager die or walk into ahouse were the person has quit breathing hey Pam whatcha gonna do come 230 in the morning make a decision now! Tough huh well the life of a person or people r in our hands. So yep keep it shut
Pam J
8:26 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
Okay, let's agree to disagree. I don't see a big problem and you do. So be it.
Kimberly
8:35 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
The thing that's so irritating about this entire conversation is that they were never going to close ALL of the libraries. There would still be 4 big branches. You might have to drive a little further, but it would still be available for use for free! Just for kicks I drove by the Kennesaw Library when I left work yesterday. It was right after school (3:30pm) and there were 3 whole cars in the parking lot. One can only assume that at least 2 of those cars were for staff members and possibly the 3rd car was someone using the library.
I've also heard numerous times "What about the homeschooled kids?" What about them? That's a choice that their parents made. I'm not saying that it was a bad choice, but when you choose to homeschool a child, you also accept the financial responsibility that comes along with that. If your child needs books, that's something that you have to provide. There is the Georgia Cyber Academy which is an online charter school but even with that they send you books! I just don't think that expecting the public to be put into harms way, even for 5 days, is fair or what is best at all.
cocoa
8:43 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
When you drive by the library, you are not counting the students who walk or take the bus to use the library. As a single mother, we could not afford internet or computers or reference books when my children were in school. They would walk from the school to the neighborhood library after school and do homework and such. I would pick them up on the way home. Even when we are working, some parents are not able to provide all the things their children need. And since we pay taxes, our children are allowed to use the public library.
taylor
8:52 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
Yep pam we disagree! An why ask ur local library assistant or librarian to save a person life nope the call us hummm ask a librarian to put out there fire hummm the run out yep hell it ain't that big of a deal! Call David Hankerson I am sure after his $50,000 dollar pays raise for cheating the citizens of cobb co he will hire ya!
taylor
9:09 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
Call the media an u will find out how crooked our County Is yep take a look or call ur local paper or TV person an watch people Resign but wait u will gett full retirement cause when u hire em hahahaha you give em retirement an sat yep thank ya! Thanks Mr hanerkson let's hire another yep
concerned
9:20 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
I don't agree with your logic that not one cobb firefighter has died so it won't happen. Feel free to check nfpa.org for lodd and the reason they lost their lives. If you think about the 600 firefighters that work for cobb, and that each has to furlogh 5 days by the new budget. You can see how it isn't 1 or 2 per day, rather whole stations. Each school has a library, and cobb still has cct to go to other libraries if necessary. If you believe that a library is a necessity and a fire station is not, we disagree. But I think the commissioners are more worried about reelection then well being, and they are creating an us vs them mentality rather then take the more difficult road and ask for a mill increase. This is simply a putoff untill next fiscal year, with no plan for action.
Ask how you can be wrong by 31 million, and not be held accountable.
Pam J
10:07 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
I looked at the web site you stated, but I can't find any local information. There are 683 employees in the Cobb Fire System. From what I can see, there are 30 fire stations. And I doubt that they will furlough every fireman/firewoman in one station at the same time. And as I know for a fact, there are days when at least one fire department has no calls at all. And, yes, schools have libraries, but they close when the school closes. And the CCT costs money to ride. And, no, fire stations are very important. We need them. But I also think we need libraries. If I had to choose between the two, of course I would choose a firestation. They have already cut the hours and personnel at the libraries, so they have already sacrificed. I think the only commissioner with an adverse mission is Tim Lee. If you want to fight against something completely wrong, look at some of the non-profits this county contributes to. Some may be necessary, but there are a lot that aren't. Bottom line - both the fire department and the libraries are important. I expect the fire personnel to step up to the challenge because we have some of the best out there.
Cobb Co Firefighter Wife
9:41 pm on Tuesday, April 12, 2011
Remember 5 furlough days for a 24 hour shift equals 15 regular 8 hour days. Now we are talking over 2 weeks with no pay!!!
Leroy Smith
2:52 pm on Wednesday, April 13, 2011
Pam...instead of spending time on here arguing, you should be out looking for a job instead of holding your hand out wanting everything given to you.
Pam J
7:00 pm on Wednesday, April 13, 2011
Now that's just a mean thing to say. I spend most of the day on the computer looking for jobs. My life has been completely disrupted. I can't even live in my own house because I can't afford the mortgage payment. I went from a nice little house to the spare bedroom in my brother's house. I have worked hard since I was 18. I am now 57. You really didn't deserve this explanation, but here it is anyway.
Michael Jacobs
7:56 pm on Wednesday, April 13, 2011
Come on, Leroy, we've had a pretty good discussion here about the budget. Let's not turn it into a series of personal attacks. One of the beauties of the Internet is that we can focus on the message because we don't see the messenger.
Pam J
8:09 pm on Wednesday, April 13, 2011
Thank you, Michael.
Julia Harris
9:01 pm on Wednesday, April 13, 2011
I agree with Michael. The issue here is the budget. It affects us all. Lord knows we're all struggling in the economy.
Maureen
5:33 am on Thursday, April 14, 2011
I would like to know WHY Cobb County Fire Dept responds to calls when the elderly fall in their homes. A huge fire truck is called several times a year to our neighborhood. The GAS alone for that truck to get here and there is NO FIRE! I moved here from a town that had an ambulance service for health emergencies, staffed with EMTs. All I keep thinking is what if someone really has a fire in the meantime. My son believes it has to do with the law in GA for carrying oxygen in emergency vehicles. Is this why? One neighbor is alone due to the spouse staying somewhere else and they call 911 all the time. It's our tax dollars. And why I'm at it, why do I pay $3.50 a month for street lights that go on and off and the streets are dark. Let's change the bulbs to solar or keep them on or refund the monthly charge. A lot of comments and no one is thinking of solutions. It would make sense to call other counties or states and see if there are better ways of making things work for all.
Pam J
8:57 am on Thursday, April 14, 2011
I'm curious too as to why the fire department has to go to every emergency. I don't think they used to do that. Like you said, all ambulance drivers have to be EMT's, I think. I believe that a few of the fire stations have the smaller vehicle they can drive instead of the big trucks, so maybe all of the stations should have one of those. And have you tried contacting the county about the streetlights? I'm not sure they have people driving around at night looking for burned out or just messed up lights.
Linda Rehkopf
12:38 pm on Thursday, April 14, 2011
Street light problems are handled by the power company that serves your neighborhood -- Georgia Power or Cobb EMC.
Wolfgang
2:29 am on Friday, April 15, 2011
I have had the opportunity to read some of the comments made so far, and honestly I am just worried about the lack of knowledge that is involved in the public's understanding of what the police force does.
The truth is that with the exception of the time that the officer is at your door step and starts, "I regret to have to inform you'; or when he tries to touch your hand to comfort you when you have been violated; or is tromping through the woods looking for your child; is that police work is all about perception.
The perception is that a citizen feels safe because there is a police force out there. The Police Chief is going to ensure that perception is maintained. So when you call and complain about that six year old riding up and down the street on a minibike, be assured that your response will not be delayed.
Of course the question begs how that response is going to be maintained. Simply a burglary detective will put on a uniform and back fill the furlough. Of course his twenty to forty burglary cases will all be put on HOLD status. Of course those cases were probably generated by two to three suspects, but the fact that the Federal crime statistics have already been generated by the mere fact that the burglary occurred, solving the case will never bring those stats down, but we can at least maintain the perception.
Wolfgang
2:35 am on Friday, April 15, 2011
The simple truth about traffic stops and citations is even simpler. I can complete a traffic stop from blue lights to thank in ten minutes. That sweaty, clammy feeling you get when you see those blue lights is probably going to keep you from that critical phone call you have to make while driving to your third cousin twice removed, right before you get into a vehicle collision. Once I have to respond to that accident I am out of service for about an hour.
Of course now, to fill that space, and to have an officer to be able to respond to your concern about those youths standing on the corner plotting the downfall of western civilization, we will take a detective from another unit, lets say, Domestic Violence, and put them in a uniform. Considering that theft and domestic violence account for the majority of non-traffic related contacts with the police the lack of follow up on DV cases will only lead to more complaints.
Wolfgang
2:38 am on Friday, April 15, 2011
Another misnomer I have seen about traffic citations involves revenue. Honestly, I have no idea how much your ticket is when I give it to you. But I do know that for the 100,000's of citations issued, the County generates less than 5 million dollars. I would be curious where the rest goes. The truth about traffic enforcement lies in what is known as the 'Blue Light Effect'. This is a high level concept that supervision wraps themselves in comfort with. It is a belief that by putting cars on the side of the road, that bad guys will be less inclined to take the risk to dive through the neighbourhood.
When it comes down to it, the average CCPD officer has a ridiculous amount of training, probably has a degree or four or more years of military service and cares deeply about his/her job. While we all complain about our work and the silly things that our citizens do, we really want to help. But in order for you to help, you as a citizen should fulfill your right and responsibility to know and have held accountable what your police department is doing to serve you, not just what it looks like they are doing.
Amy Barnes
9:17 pm on Saturday, April 16, 2011
Reading your comments are like taking a breath of fresh air. Finally someone else is taking the same argument up that I am trying to put out there. AUDIT the departments! "To measure is to know." - a scientist.
Pam J
8:40 am on Friday, April 15, 2011
Wolfgang, are you a police officer? I talked to a couple of Cobb County police officers yesterday and they said that furlough days would not hurt them as far as service was concerned. They were prepared to handle it. I don't know if that is a "script" they are "reading" from, but I do feel like they will be okay. They also said that the fire department will be fine too. People aren't happy about losing a week's pay, but as long as you don't lose your job, that can be dealt with. I know that some people are upset that the libraries are staying open, but also realize that some of the people working in them will probably be let go and the hours will be shortened (again). If you are a county employee, things are a little tough right now. And if they had hired me for any of the jobs I applied for in the past year, I would be right there with you. I am very happy to see people get involved in some of the big issues this year. I think that most of the time we are apathetic about what our county officials are doing.
Wolfgang
6:51 pm on Friday, April 15, 2011
@Pam
I am sure that there are many officers who have committed themselves to ensuring that there will be no interruption in service. I would actually suspect that it would be the majority, and for the citizens there will be little to no measurable effect.
What I was hoping for the citizens to learn to ask is why do we keep doing the things that we do when they do not work. We as a department are very inflexible when it comes to adapting to change and I am very concerned that the citizens are not pushing their representative to explain themselves.
I would start to ask that of the 31 million that was a shortfall, how much (20 million) has been pushed to next years budget? If we are having difficulty with a shortfall now, how are we going to close a budget with added debt forwarded on?
As for my personal feelings, it is hard after more than two decades of work in which I have been shot at, having to shoot people, fought for my life and have the scars to prove it that I am going to be put aside for a week. But that is a personal feeling that in fullness doesn't bear on the question that yes I can manage without a week of pay. I also have had the opportunity to see what the economy has done to others. Some I regret brought the extent of misery on themselves, others, if not most have just been served hard.
Back to tangent, citizens need to ensure that they are blinded by show and tell/divide and conquer tactics of the commissioners and demand accountability at all levels.
Pam J
7:00 pm on Friday, April 15, 2011
So many of the prior comments seem to focus on the fire department, but the police have, what I consider, a more dangerous job in Cobb County. Especially in this economy where more of the "bad" comes out in people. And at least everybody has the time to prepare for a week without pay. Maybe eat out a few less times and save a little more money to get by. I was lucky to get three months severance pay when I lost my job, but people that don't get any severance and are put there with no warning are the ones that have the worst time. And I don't know you personally, but I am glad you are still around to talk about this.
Amy Barnes
10:10 pm on Saturday, April 16, 2011
@Wolf - I do not trust the County financial books - if we already have HALF a MILLION unaccounted for, then what ELSE are they hiding? Has anyone else asked WHY we are in a deficit, before trying to fill that deficit?
I will be happy to tell you that the Animal Control officers are the nicest and most respectful ones you have on staff. As for the rest of the force... What about the strong-arm tactics that police use when "asking" John and Jane Doe to open the (car or house) door for a warrant-less investigation?
Investigator: "We are required to do this by law." HA!
My reply : "Your legal duty shall not infringe upon, nor waive any of, my Constitutional RIGHTS! Now get going - and leave me alone."
Do you really think that I will allow a search, or even do as much as answer the door to angry-sounding, thumping, screaming police officers who crowd my doorway without a search warrant? And - YES - I have *actually* kicked Cobb Police off my property for using strong-arm tactics. After that, I bought out Home Depot's entire stock of No Trespass signs and had a party posting them all over my property. I am considering a fence, too.
Cathy Logan
11:55 am on Saturday, April 16, 2011
Cobb County has too many police.
Amy Barnes
10:11 pm on Saturday, April 16, 2011
... and too many fishing trips - they have to fill that artificial need for more prisoners with this shiny new jail we have.
Bill
12:38 pm on Saturday, April 16, 2011
"Cobb County has too many police."
==========================
Part 1 of 2 parts:
Don't know what 'too many' might be, if you are a crook then probably there are too many, if your home got burgled then you might think there is not enough.
One thing seems very clear to me: To many people are employeed at various levels of government. Makes no difference if it is city, county, state or federal. There are to many feeding at the government groughs. Generally they get better pay for government work than those doing similar jobs in private practice, they get good benefits and many are civil service.
Having said that, I can think of exceptions, just one is the DMV, where the pay in Ga. totally sucks and it seems to me they can't keep people at what they pay. But as I said this seems an exception.
Pam J
4:14 pm on Saturday, April 16, 2011
I don't think we can ever have too many police officers out there. Better safe than sorry. And I have applied for a lot of jobs with Cobb County over the past year, and the pay scale is usually more than any of the jobs I have applied for in the private sector. Heck, they were advertising for a custodian at over $12.00 an hour. And if you look at the federal level, they pay even more. I believe that our police officers should be paid a lot of money because of the danger they are in every day. Not for writing speeding tickets, but for not knowing if the person they pull over is going to run or pull a gun on them. I would like to see the police driving through neighborhoods more often than sitting on the side of the road with their radar guns pointed at cars as they drive by. You are right about the DMV. If they need to let people go from other departments, put them in one of the DMV offices.
Bill
12:39 pm on Saturday, April 16, 2011
Part 2 of 2 parts (done this way because this site limits your comment length)
We won't have any worthwhile reductions while we keep so many on the various government payrolls. Should they be fired? No, just put in a hiring and pay freeze for 2 years or so and the problem will over time take care of itself without adding to the unemployment lines. Also we should immediately cut down many departments to 4 day work weeks. Won't work across the board of course, for those departments that can't operate on 4 day schedules (law enforcement/fire/prisons etc) institute furloughs of 2-4 days per month.
I see some unions in the Northern states bitching and moaning about potential cuts in pay and particularly benefits. If they can get better jobs then they should take them, my opinion is that if you have a job in todays bad economy then you should be pleased to have it, if you don't want it there are a heck of a lot of other people who would be glad to have it.
Ivory Dorsey, Speaker, Facilitator, and Author
5:37 pm on Saturday, April 16, 2011
We must NOT tamper with our police protection. Police presence generates crime PREVENTION. Cobb county has always maintained a "don't even think about committing crime in Cobb" presence. It is for a time such as this. They are held to a higher standard the minute they put on the uniform and the weapon, including putting their lives on the line. This must be acknowledged and protected at all cost. Police are not to be treated like everybody else. THEY PROTECT EVERYBODY ELSE. Because of our police force, "everyone else" in Cobb gets to rest a little easier knowing that as many things are out of our control, there is one thing we can count on. We must rest easy knowing that our police force is a FORCE to be reckoned with. While everyone is struggling with the realities of doing more with less; the only peace of mind we have is that the law enforcement personnel is at peace, they are present, and assured that they are NOT like everybody else; they are to protect everybody else without the anxiety of being treated like "everybody else."
Maureen
7:22 pm on Saturday, April 16, 2011
This is just a thought and maybe an idea of how the community can help.
On the millionaire show there was a community where men wore T-shirts called "Manpower"? The community had volunteers walk the streets of their subdivisions to look for abandon homes, suspicious activity, etc. What if we had a meeting to advise, possibly direct instructions from the police force, for this volunteer group to help bring attention to situations that they may not know of since they can't be everywhere all the time. As a benefit for the volunteers, maybe an incentive, like a point system, could be gained for the hours given to the team. I know there is a lot of legal issues but the call to police from anyone in this group would help them, make our neighbors feel safer, especially the elderly, and the known presence of this group would benefit all. What do you think? Yes we can make a difference with a positive attitude and appreciation for the police force already trying to keep us safe.
Pam J
9:37 am on Sunday, April 17, 2011
Sounds like a plan to me. You can put "neighborhood watch" signs at the entrance of your subdivision, but they don't mean much unless you have a lot of retired or unemployed people living around you. But I'm not sure how to get something like this started.
mary kirkendoll
9:04 am on Sunday, April 17, 2011
Look, NOBODY wants to speak the truth around here! The 2005 SPLOST has been MISmanaged,... STOLEN from the taxpayers! Drive around Cobb County-- it's a DISASTER! How to compare? Drive over to Peachtree Industrial exit north- unbelievably beautiful, As it works its way up past Doraville, through Norcross(totally revitilized historic city) , up through Duluth(absolutely beautiful!). Work your way east through side streets, & major roadways,.. take a peek @ Suwanee, Lawrencville, Sugar Hill & Grayson! Almost every CORNER of Gwinnett feels updated, lush landscaping along roads, new businesses, sleek buildings,parks, greenways, biketrails. etc. Gwinnett just looks clean & pretty!! (& yes there still are a few bad pockets of illegals,.. but you can tell, they are working hard to CHANGE it!!)
I know you all want to remember 'the old rundown' Gwinnett,... but they have been taking care of business & it SHOWS!
Cobb gold ole boy cronyism has wasted & pocketed much of the 2005 SPLOST , more than $700 MILLION?
And now, you're going to let them do it again?
We wouldn't be in a shortfal, if Cobb was being run in an HONEST manner. The money that's being pocketed would pay for ALL the police & fire we need!
I'd move to Gwinnett in a heartbeat,.. if I could get enough peanuts for my devalued house , here in the poor 3rd world of corruption,... SMYRNA!
Take a drive up Cobb Parkway, South Cobb Drive, Six Flags, Veterens Memorial (boy, some memorial)-& tell me where the money went??
Pam J
9:42 am on Sunday, April 17, 2011
I do believe they mismanaged the money somewhat. I guess one of the things they did was install the "countdown" walk signs at the intersections. They redid the bridge on Concord Road (thank goodness), and did several road paving projects. But you are correct in the fact that the areas that need help didn't get it. Every county will always have areas that aren't very "pretty", but you would think that the extra millions they got from us would have helped a little more. And Smyrna has been up and down. Years ago, nobody wanted to live there because nobody could pronouce the name. Then everybody figured it was the closest city in the county to downtown Atlanta and tiny little houses started selling for $350,000. So those people who bought the little 2-bedroom, 1 bath houses a few years ago for $350,000 are really feeling the heat.
Pati Alexander
8:32 pm on Monday, April 18, 2011
Does nobody notice they are closing two Senior centers to balance this budget? As if that would actually make a difference? The Senior Day Center has 30 seniors, most of which have physical disabilities as well as dementia and Alzheimer's. The county has given these families just a few days more than 2 weeks to find alternative placement. 17 days to find placement that is affordable and comparable to what we are losing. Most of us keep our loved ones at home and we work full time to do so. Without this placement, some of us will have to quit our jobs. So, now we have libraries open, so I guess our Seniors can go there all day, instead. Right?
These are the people who survived the Great Depression and these are the people that the Board has decided to throw under the bus.
It is shameful...
Maureen
9:18 pm on Tuesday, April 19, 2011
I saw this closing also and my heart sank. I wonder if Bill (April 12 comment) saw this also. He states that there will be no closings, it was all political. I wonder if he saw this closing. I hate the elderly suffering at their most vulnerable time in their lives. They gave so much and they are always the victims. Where and how will their families cope? I am with you Pati on this one. Maybe these politicians have extra rooms in their homes for these stranded seniors? Doubt it!
Ivory Dorsey, Speaker, Facilitator, and Author
9:16 pm on Monday, April 18, 2011
The path of least resistance is usually the path taken.
“We’re lost, but we’re making good time!”
—YOGI BERRA, American baseball player, on his way to Cooperstown, home of the National Baseball Hall of Fame
C. onfused
8:22 pm on Thursday, April 21, 2011
I'm curious, what the Bible says about paying your bills, and paying your creditors.... is it considered stealing if you don't? I know what it says about paying your taxes... is it considered the same?
Ivory Dorsey, Speaker, Facilitator, and Author
9:07 pm on Thursday, April 21, 2011
Confused. The Bible is pretty graphic on Debt.
Yes, the Bible has the taxes part spelled out. However, debt is pretty well covered as well. It is clear that the right to collect debt is so strong in the Bible it is aligned with Forgiveness. In addition, it provides that people could be imprisoned or committed to slavery.
The Bible absolutely has no respect for debt: “The rich rules over the poor, and the borrower is servant to the lender.” Prov 22:7
“Owe no one anything except to love one another, for he who loves another has fulfilled the law.” Owe no man any thing (KJV). Let no debt remain outstanding (NIV). Pay all your debts (TLB). Owe nothing to anyone (NASB). Keep out of debt and own no man anything (Amplified). Romans 13:8
See: Matthew 18:22-35 (New King James Version)
While it does NOT itemize non payment of debt as a sin; it has the effect of stealing which is a violation of the 10 commandents, #8 You shall not steal. Debt is extended based on the commitment to repay. To not repay is stealing by deception. Is it a sin? You decide. (see article below.)
What the Bible Says about Money: Debt
by Jason Price on January 17, 2010 in Bible & Money, Featured, Get Out of Debt : http://www.onemoneydesign.com/what-the-bible-says-about-money-debt/
Is it a sin to be in debt?
You may be relieved to know that no where in the Bible does it say it is a sin to be in debt. However, the Bible does encourage us to avoid debt.
Pam J
11:05 pm on Thursday, April 21, 2011
I'm confused as to why you are bringing religion into this conversation. We seem to be going off on a different road.
Ivory Dorsey, Speaker, Facilitator, and Author
6:34 am on Friday, April 22, 2011
The inquiry from "confused" on 8:22pm on Thursday, April 21, 2011, prompted my response. Looks like "Confused" confused the discussion..............the road is the same.
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